Hello from Sweden

[Hajen13]

Hello again,

Yet another question to the forum on something i have been thinking about without founding an answer.

Is there anyone in here or somebody in here who know people who have lost glandes without ever have worn contact lenses, doing lasers operations and been on accutane (maybe i am forgetting some common reason)?

People like me who got the problem because of staring into a screen all day long.

[Topher3]

Hello again,

Yet another question to the forum on something i have been thinking about without founding an answer.

Is there anyone in here or somebody in here who know people who have lost glandes without ever have worn contact lenses, doing lasers operations and been on accutane (maybe i am forgetting some common reason)?

People like me who got the problem because of staring into a screen all day long.

That’s the thing, it’s so hard because I’ve never done any of the things you’ve mentioned apart from a creen staring and I have shortened glands. However I do have ocular rosecea and seborrheic dermatitis so I guess that rules me out as they play a major role in contributing to MGD.

I dont think there is people people who have mgd just from looking at screens, because then you have to go down the route of people who are on anti depressants and they have a chance to play a role and there’s so many people on that.

Just think for a second, out in the wild the animals always stare for long amount of time does that mean they get mgd? Animals are always in a stressed state and are on alert for predators. I really am not sure how low low a blink rate has to be to cause problems but for it to block up in the glands I feel like there has to be a secondary problem to initiate and cause dry eyes to activate.

[Alix]

Hello again,

Yet another question to the forum on something i have been thinking about without founding an answer.

Is there anyone in here or somebody in here who know people who have lost glandes without ever have worn contact lenses, doing lasers operations and been on accutane (maybe i am forgetting some common reason)?

People like me who got the problem because of staring into a screen all day long.

I guess this is where genetics come into play. It’s like we all know smoking is a major cause of lung cancer and people die of it through passive smoking or smoking a few cigarettes a week for a couple of years and yet there are people who smoke a lot more than that and are still alive at 100 cancer free.

[Topher3]

I guess this is where genetics come into play. It’s like we all know smoking is a major cause of lung cancer and people die of it through passive smoking or smoking a few cigarettes a week for a couple of years and yet there are people who smoke a lot more than that and are still alive at 100 cancer free.

Alix i think she’s absolutely right, genetics play a huge role more than we can every imagine. We all have to learn to not be so hard on ourselves and not blame ourselves as we didn’t wilfully put ourselves in this position. everyone in this world trying to survive and for most people, life is going to have some hiccups, plain and simple, the end. We have to stop comparing what we have to others, realise what we’re dealing with, accept it and then we can move to the next step and love our lives and ourselves wholly. Stay strong everyone, life will improve and if it doesn’t then keep on going until it does :-)

[Chemia]

Genetics play a huge role. There are certain triggers and circumstances that can make MGD worse but if you are genetically predisposed to having it, there is not a whole lot you can do to stop it. I know people who take Accutane, smoke, LASIK, poor eating habits, prolonged contact lens use and have no issues with their eyes and you can be so healthy and have dry eyes. I remember telling my corneal specialist that I had completed 4 rounds of IPL performed by another doctor and his response was "your glands are going to revert back to how they were and IPL is temporary. Its all in your DNA". Needless to say, I stopped doing further IPL treatments.

[Hajen13]

As always thanks for the responses! Forgot about the antidepressants and rosecea as two major contributers to MGD.

Yes genetics have to play a role in this as i am sure me and a lot of others have not done anything different from millions of others who also have a work which involves 8-9 hours in front of a screen. And the same
for all of you who have been introduced to MGD by these contributing conditions/products ect.

But just to sum up, it doesn't seem to be a lot of persons if anyone (?) on this forum who have lost glandes without being exposed by these often mentioned conditions/products?.

[Topher3]

As always thanks for the responses! Forgot about the antidepressants and rosecea as two major contributers to MGD.

Yes genetics have to play a role in this as i am sure me and a lot of others have not done anything different from millions of others who also have a work which involves 8-9 hours in front of a screen. And the same
for all of you who have been introduced to MGD by these contributing conditions/products ect.

But just to sum up, it doesn't seem to be a lot of persons if anyone (?) on this forum who have lost glandes without being exposed by these often mentioned conditions/products?.

I believe it’s unlikely that just poor blinks can cause glands to block on their own. The oil isn’t going to block up if you blink not often, it’s a predisposition, there’s homeless people on the streets that don’t shower for weeks and live in absolute filth who don’t have dry eyes. You can’t tell me the computer of all things is going to **** up the glands. If it was then there’d be billions with this problem.

this is going to sound really out of place but, I think that certain flus and colds have bacteria that have certain strands that can cause a weird immune response within the body that attacks tissues and not allowing the white blood cells to do their thing. Causing inflammation and damage under the surface until it’s bad enough that symptoms arise. I truly think that bacteri are evolving due to the chronic overuse of antibiotics that are being abused in today’s modern society.

[Milo007]

I believe it’s unlikely that just poor blinks can cause glands to block on their own. The oil isn’t going to block up if you blink not often, it’s a predisposition, there’s homeless people on the streets that don’t shower for weeks and live in absolute filth who don’t have dry eyes. You can’t tell me the computer of all things is going to **** up the glands. If it was then there’d be billions with this problem.

this is going to sound really out of place but, I think that certain flus and colds have bacteria that have certain strands that can cause a weird immune response within the body that attacks tissues and not allowing the white blood cells to do their thing. Causing inflammation and damage under the surface until it’s bad enough that symptoms arise. I truly think that bacteri are evolving due to the chronic overuse of antibiotics that are being abused in today’s modern society.

You are partially correct when you say that the meibomian glands cannot get blocked due to partial or incomplete blinking. I believe that "prolonged" partial blinking can cause blockage of the glands. It is the habit of partial blinking over years that results in the blockage of the glands. When one blinks partially most of the time the meibum inside the glands do not get expressed at the rate at which it is being synthesized. So there is either a stagnation or a reduced rate of flow of meibum within the central duct of the glands. Now stagnation doesn't cause the blockage itself. It's the bacteria naturally residing inside our meibomian glands that utilizes this opportunity and causes the conversion of the lipids to free fatty acids which have elevated melting temperatures and hence they solidify at the normal temperature of the ocular surface. Demodex might also cause terminal duct obstruction inducing hyperkeratinization which again causes statis of the meibum and the bacteria join the party.

So it's pretty much similar to acne vulgaris when hyperkeratinization within the sebaceous glands cause an obstruction and P. Acnes causes an inflammatory response by releasing toxic wastes inside the blocked gland. In the case of meibomian glands the stagnation of the meibum provides time for the bacteria to facilitate the conversion of the lipids. If the flow of meibum was faster due to evenly spaced complete blinks then the lipids would have continuously moved out of the glands before the conversion could take place.

This is just one way of developing MGD. Mind it there could be at least dozens of other ways the meibomian glands can be adversely affected. All end up causing the glands to malfunction which is common.

I don't think evolved bacteria is the cause of MGD since if that was the case I should not have developed it. I didn't take antibiotics for a decade maybe before I got this. I am very reluctant to take antibiotics unless absolutely necessary. Also I have seen plenty of people who abuse antibiotics like regular sleeping pills and they don't have MGD.

The inflammation kicks in once the LLT drops down due to either partial or complete blockage of the glands or the glands not secreting enough lipids. Chronic inflammation amplifies the cycle of MGD and damages the glands further slowly and steadily until you have most of the glands malfunctioning.

[Topher3]

You are partially correct when you say that the meibomian glands cannot get blocked due to partial or incomplete blinking. I believe that "prolonged" partial blinking can cause blockage of the glands. It is the habit of partial blinking over years that results in the blockage of the glands. When one blinks partially most of the time the meibum inside the glands do not get expressed at the rate at which it is being synthesized. So there is either a stagnation or a reduced rate of flow of meibum within the central duct of the glands. Now stagnation doesn't cause the blockage itself. It's the bacteria naturally residing inside our meibomian glands that utilizes this opportunity and causes the conversion of the lipids to long chain fatty acids which have elevated melting temperatures and hence they solidify at the normal temperature of the ocular surface. Demodex might also cause terminal duct obstruction inducing hyperkeratinization which again causes statis of the meibum and the bacteria join the party.

So it's pretty much similar to acne vulgaris when hyperkeratinization within the sebaceous glands cause an obstruction and P. Acnes causes an inflammatory response by releasing toxic wastes inside the blocked gland. In the case of meibomian glands the stagnation of the meibum provides time for the bacteria to facilitate the conversion of the lipids. If the flow of meibum was faster due to evenly spaced complete blinks then the lipids would have continuously moved out of the glands before the conversion could take place.

This is just one way of developing MGD. Mind it there could be at least dozens of other ways the meibomian glands can be adversely affected. All end up causing the glands to malfunction which is common.

I don't think evolved bacteria is the cause of MGD since if that was the case I should not have developed it. I didn't take antibiotics for a decade maybe before I got this. I am very reluctant to take antibiotics unless absolutely necessary. Also I have seen plenty of people who abuse antibiotics like regular sleeping pills and they don't have MGD.

The inflammation kicks in once the LLT drops down due to either partial or complete blockage of the glands or the glands not secreting enough lipids. Chronic inflammation amplifies the cycle of MGD and damages the glands further slowly and steadily until you have most of the glands malfunctioning.

You’re right, it’s the bacteria that causes the meibum to solidify. I believe certain people have more of certain bacteria’s within the body. And that people with this predisposition allows the opportunity for MGD to be more prevelant in these people.

whether you take anti biotics or not is irrelevant, the problem is everyone else that abuses them forces the bacteria in our WORLD to evolve to be able to still exist against our technology that is trying to eradicate it. And when someone comes in contact with certain bacteria’s that have evolved, and their genes don’t allow the body to kill them (bacterias) effectively, they’re more susceptible to inflammation and solidifying oils. And people with certain bacteria’s on their body (like you said with acne)and certain conditions such as psoriasis, seborrheic dermatitis, eczema etc.... their body struggles to fight it off so in turn they get these diseases. Same with MGD I believe.
i believe that people body’s cannot handle certain strands of bacteria make the chance of MGD to skyrocket throughout that persons lifetime whether it’s from immune response or overgrowth. Blinking is only a part of it, you need to be hit from multiple sides to activate the shit storm.

[Milo007]

You’re right, it’s the bacteria that causes the meibum to solidify. I believe certain people have more of certain bacteria’s within the body. And that people with this predisposition allows the opportunity for MGD to be more prevelant in these people.

Also the ****ing demodex mites. They carry bacteria (specially bacillus oleronius) inside their intestines and when they die their body explodes releasing the pathogens. The toxic wastes produced by the bacteria invokes a high immune response. So these mites have been hired by the bacteria to act as Trojan horses as protection against our immunity.

whether you take anti biotics or not is irrelevant, the problem is everyone else that abuses them forces the bacteria in our WORLD to evolve to be able to still exist against our technology that is trying to eradicate it. And when someone comes in contact with certain bacteria’s that have evolved, and their genes don’t allow the body to kill them (bacterias) effectively, they’re more susceptible to inflammation and solidifying oils. And people with certain bacteria’s on their body (like you said with acne)and certain conditions such as psoriasis, seborrheic dermatitis, eczema etc.... their body struggles to fight it off so in turn they get these diseases. Same with MGD I believe.
i believe that people body’s cannot handle certain strands of bacteria make the chance of MGD to skyrocket throughout that persons lifetime whether it’s from immune response or overgrowth. Blinking is only a part of it, you need to be hit from multiple sides to activate the shit storm.

I agree. And not to mention the compromise in our natural immunity thanks to all the artificial chemicals we are subjected to every day like pesticides in vegetables and fruits, telfon from non stick cookware, preservatives in food, increased levels of toxic gases in the atmosphere due to pollution and so on. All of these are provoking some kind of immune response in our body in some way and people are getting auto immune diseases as unbelievably common occurrences these days. Mankind is setting up its own coffin nicely.

[Topher3]

[QUOTE=Milo007;n223493



I agree. And not to mention the compromise in our natural immunity thanks to all the artificial chemicals we are subjected to every day like pesticides in vegetables and fruits, telfon from non stick cookware, preservatives in food, increased levels of toxic gases in the atmosphere due to pollution and so on. All of these are provoking some kind of immune response in our body in some way and people are getting auto immune diseases as unbelievably common occurrences these days. Mankind is setting up its own coffin nicely. [/QUOTE]

Love this, you’re absolutely right. Humans never learn until it’s too late, too much greed.

[Hajen13]

Hi again,

I would just like to make an update.

I went to the dryclinic in Oslo (thank you Alix on this forum) this summer and wow what a quality difference compared to the clinic
i was used to here in Stockholm.

Previously i have been hearing that i have all my meiboumian glands remaining. After the scan they doctor
(Sten Ræder) did in Oslo they could tell that is not really the case, they could see that i have lost
almost 50 percent of my meiboumian glands. I also have inflammations in the eyelids.

I was prescribed:

* 3 months doxycline
* Warm compress
* 10 days of different eye drops with cortisone (Monopex and Softacort)
* Thealoz duo gel 3 times a day (i quitted taking this gel after a while since i felt it made
things worse)



And the doctor also put punctual plugs into the tearducts.

------------------

I just recently finished the doxycline cure since i had to wait until after the summer to be able
to begin taking the pills since you should not combine them with sunny days.

Unfortunately i have not felt any improvement at all since my visit to the clinic.
Not really surprised since nothing i have done since my eyes got dry 6-7 years ago has
helped. My state is slowly but steady getting worse.

I can barely get through the working days in front of my computer. I am always working from home
instead of the office since it makes thing slightly easier (not having to face people and
the dry air in the office).

But this cant go on, i have came to a point were the work is no longer of importance. I have
to get away from the screen at any prize as it is making my condition worse. I am also
scared of that it contributes to an even faster gland loss.

7 years of serious reduced life quality. I am now 28 years old.... Life is
ticking on but its not possible to participate.

When are the magic eyedrops that will solve all problems finally going to be on the market?
Are we going to find them at any dryeye clinic? I guess not since it would probably ruin there
business.

I am going to book a new time at the clinic in Olso and see what i gives me though since
i have a big trust in the knowledge of the doctor (Sten).

[Alix]

Hi good to hear you made it to the Oslo clinic and you finally got some answers.
Sorry that you have not seen any improvement...you just need to carry on trying different things, what works for one person doesn't necessarily work for another.
Do keep us updated and let us know what the doctor says on your next visit.
Good luck!

[Hajen13]

Thank you i will! And thanks again for recommending the clinic so that i could finaly see a doctor who really knows what he is talking about.

[Guest]

Hi again,

I would just like to make an update.

I went to the dryclinic in Oslo (thank you Alix on this forum) this summer and wow what a quality difference compared to the clinic
i was used to here in Stockholm.

Previously i have been hearing that i have all my meiboumian glands remaining. After the scan they doctor
(Sten Ræder) did in Oslo they could tell that is not really the case, they could see that i have lost
almost 50 percent of my meiboumian glands. I also have inflammations in the eyelids.

I was prescribed:

* 3 months doxycline
* Warm compress
* 10 days of different eye drops with cortisone (Monopex and Softacort)
* Thealoz duo gel 3 times a day (i quitted taking this gel after a while since i felt it made
things worse)



And the doctor also put punctual plugs into the tearducts.

------------------

I just recently finished the doxycline cure since i had to wait until after the summer to be able
to begin taking the pills since you should not combine them with sunny days.

Unfortunately i have not felt any improvement at all since my visit to the clinic.
Not really surprised since nothing i have done since my eyes got dry 6-7 years ago has
helped. My state is slowly but steady getting worse.

I can barely get through the working days in front of my computer. I am always working from home
instead of the office since it makes thing slightly easier (not having to face people and
the dry air in the office).

But this cant go on, i have came to a point were the work is no longer of importance. I have
to get away from the screen at any prize as it is making my condition worse. I am also
scared of that it contributes to an even faster gland loss.

7 years of serious reduced life quality. I am now 28 years old.... Life is
ticking on but its not possible to participate.

When are the magic eyedrops that will solve all problems finally going to be on the market?
Are we going to find them at any dryeye clinic? I guess not since it would probably ruin there
business.

I am going to book a new time at the clinic in Olso and see what i gives me though since
i have a big trust in the knowledge of the doctor (Sten).

Hey there read your story... I making great progress DM me if you need some tips.