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**Rebecca Petris** · 17-Nov-2006, 13:11

This might not be what you're looking for but my first thought is: tincture of time. You're 5 months out from surgery, right? I think there's kind of a general consensus amongst us lasik old-timers that the first year is the toughest - physically and emotionally, but emphasis on the latter (which affects the former...). I don't want to sound discouraging but honestly, it may not be realistic expect to become as productive/efficient as you were very quickly. The stress alone wreaks havoc with your concentration and I'm sensing some of that in your description of what you're experiencing. So my suggestion is, cut yourself some slack about how long it might take to start feeling a little more like your old self again.

Forgive me for throwing yet more links at you but...

Living with dry eyes

A lot of what is in the articles you can get to from that page are basically summaries of advice shared in these forums by patients over a long period of time. Worth perusing.

**YGB** · 17-Nov-2006, 13:32

Thanks Rebecca.

You are providing a wonderful service through your site. I am sure that the work of you and the support group has prevented many disasters.

You are correct that I am 5.5 months post-LASIK. I know that I am still a "baby" in this world and I, like everyone, hopes to someday graduate. However, I am confused when MD's tell me that I have plenty of healing left, but they then tell me that my condition is chronic. I suppose they are trying to tell me that I should see improvement, but that I will also have to live with DES in some form for the rest of my life (isn't that what chronic means?)

The problem with DES is that it is cumulative and constant. Each day adds to the previous day of pain and irritation. While I am down today, overall I am improving my mental state, but I must admit that my mental state feels metastable. I guess that after about a year of dealing with DES, the mind and body typically learn to accept and better adjust to DES. Also, hopefully I will continue moving out of my bottomed out zone physically. There has been improvement, but it is painfully slowwwww and certainly not steady. I suppose we all have to keep hoping and/or praying for improvement.

If there are any other suggestions ... I'm listening.

**kitty** · 17-Nov-2006, 18:41

I would have to agree with Rebecca. I was at a point 4-6 months in to my diagnosis that I was not sure I could cope. It seemed like my whole life evolved around DES. However, it does seem that with time, I have learned to manage my DES rather than it managing me. Through my management of my DES, I have slowly become more comfortable with time. I have exhausted every option my eye doc has in his arsenal short of scleral lenses or surgery. I have finally come to accept that while this DES is a real bummer, I could have something much worse. The only thing I can tell you is to focus on those things that you can do, and try not to think about so much those things that are too uncomfortable for you to do. I used to baby myself and avoid places that bothered my eyes. I soon learned, however, that being a hermit was much worse than the 24 hours or so it took my eyes to recover from exposure to a bad environment. I just plan it so I don't have to work or look my best the day after I go to a movie theatre or some other place that is not DES friendly. Most important, hang out here. It is one of the few places where you really can get support when you need it.

**YGB** · 17-Nov-2006, 19:23

Thanks Kitty

I plan on going to the museum with my wife and kids tomorrow. It will be our first family outing together in quite awhile. I was hesitant to go with them due to DES, but it is good to hear people like you who've been in my DES place earlier on encourage me to proceed. I'll bring the drops and try to enjoy my time as best I can.

I understand that life must go on with or without DES, but I have been working with the hope that babying my eyes will help them heal. However, unlike a broken leg, there is no definitive timeline (or guarantee for that matter) for improving with DES and the questions become ... when should I try to begin living life again? Will trying to live my life again further damage my eyes when they are hopefully healing? I suppose based on your recommendations, I'll need to be patient and take baby steps at first and go from there. Thank you!

**Richard_R** · 17-Nov-2006, 19:37

YGB,

I had RK 18 years ago and have had DES since. The things that help me:

1. Get plenty of sleep.
2. Splash my eyes with cool water regularly (every 15 to 30 min) if possible.
3. Learned to create water in my eyes by yawning, takes practice.
4. Keep eyelids clean. Resist the urge to put fingers in the eyes.
5. Stay well hydrated, drink plenty of water.
6. Stay off the computer

.

Unfortunately, for me, drops and the hot compresses make things worse. I don't know why but they make my eyes ache. I'm constantly trying new things but these are the only things that work for me.

You are still early in your recovery, there is still an good chance things can resolve themselves for you. My eyes did see improvement during the first 2-3 years. Hang in there, you will see improvement.

Richard.

**YGB** · 17-Nov-2006, 20:22

Thanks Richard

I will definitely try to hang in there and I am trying my best to be optimistic that life will continue to get better again. I appreciate you sharing things that have worked for you. You mentioned that drops don't help. While it is very likely that in your 18 years of DES you have tried TheraTears, I bring it up because it seems to be the easiest drop on the eyes. Of course, it doesn't seem to last too long, but since you are using cold water every 15-30 minutes, it may be worth another try. I think the cold water feels good, but doesn't necessarily wet the eye in an ideal way. I know that I am still early in the process but I have researched DES very intensively since it hit me hard so while I am new and still wet behind the ears (but not eyes), it may be worth giving TheraTears another try if it's been awhile. I am following all of your other regimends and have even learned to generate some tears with yawning. My daughter keeps asking why daddy is so tired all of the time

.

**angela641** · 17-Nov-2006, 21:10

I still don't know how to cope and live with DES... every doctor I see can't seem to help me. My eyes constantly water and have to be wiped with a kleenex (literally every 30 seconds to 1 minute).. or else tears run down over my eyes. This in turn, causes my eyes to be RED, and sore from wiping so much. I had my bottom of my eyes plugged, this was supposed to help keep my tears in my eyes, but it's not... so I guess it was a waste of time. My eyes are always itchy and I have to always wipe out stringy slimy stuff, which makes my eyes even more red and sore. I have tried every kind of allergy pill over the counter, nothing stops my eyes from itching, or watering... or being red. I tried Singulair also, didn't help. I plan on making an appointment with an allergy doctor and hope they can help me. My eyes are very dry which is why I produce the slimy stringy stuff, and it's why they water.. but I think some allergies are playing some kind of role because my eyes itch like crazy and are red and watery... dunno what else it could be.

I notice people on here always say drink plenty of water... why? For me, I can't, I have a fluid restriction.. i'm on dialysis... so whatever drinkig lot of water does, I can' enjoy the benefit of.

I don't like going in public because it always looks as if I just got done crying... or haven't slept in ages (but i sleep 7 hrs every night)... I hate wiping my eyes and someone always asking, ARE YOU OK? Im like, yah im not crying i have dry eyes...

**Lucy** · 17-Nov-2006, 22:30

I notice people on here always say drink plenty of water... why? For me, I can't, I have a fluid restriction.. i'm on dialysis... so whatever drinkig lot of water does, I can' enjoy the benefit of.

Angela, people are just being very basic when they say to "drink more/enough water." In most cases, it won't hurt and may help. Most people do not drink enough water and so to start trying to fix your dry eyes, it's just the first thing to start with. It "drinking lots of water" fixed dry eyes, this board would not be here. If drinking an extra glass of water before meals would cure being fat, no one would be overweight either.

For you, of course, you'll follow your doctors instructions about your liquid intake.

**angela641** · 18-Nov-2006, 01:18

Originally posted by Lucy

Angela, people are just being very basic when they say to "drink more/enough water." In most cases, it won't hurt and may help. Most people do not drink enough water and so to start trying to fix your dry eyes, it's just the first thing to start with. It "drinking lots of water" fixed dry eyes, this board would not be here. If drinking an extra glass of water before meals would cure being fat, no one would be overweight either.

For you, of course, you'll follow your doctors instructions about your liquid intake.

Ahh... ok... just wondered what it was all about. I don't urinate so everything I drink stays in me until I pull it out doing dialysis... so, I try to drinks my max amount of fluid to stay as hydrated as possible without over doing it.

**shells** · 18-Nov-2006, 06:41

Hi YGB,

I have to agree with Rebecca and the others on this one. I believe that time is going to help you learn to cope. First off, like many people have said, since you are only 5.5 months post-op you may see dramatic improvement and not even have to be dealing with this some day. However, as a fellow lasik dry eye sufferer, I can tell you that time is the only thing that helped me. I had lasik 17 months ago, and unfortunately for me have not seen much improvement physically (don't let that discourage you though!!). I had my surgery when I was 26 and thought, why not, the sooner the better...if I get it done now I can enjoy the benefits longer! Well, like most of us here with dry eyes...I was wrong. I was always a very optimistic and happy person. (I know, we all say stuff like that now...but seriously...I was always optimistic!!!!). I'm not even sure I knew what an anxiety attack was. And then came June 24th, 2005..........

After my lasik it all changed. I found myself in the darkest place I could imagine. My depression was severe, but I tried to stay away from anti-depressants because of the drying effects. I didn't know how to handle it. Like you I paced because I didn't know what else to do with myself. I wasn't sleeping, I wasn't eating. I could barely get through a day without crying. The pain and discomfort from the dry eye was maddening, as was the fluctuations. Just when I thought maybe I was making progress, I'd find myself back at square one. I OBSESSED over my lasik date. "If only I could go back", "if only I could have walked out of there". It went from, "if only it was 1 month ago, if only 2 months ago, if only 3 months ago, if only 1 year ago....my life was so much better then". Seriously, I obsessed ridiculously over that date and wanting to go back and make it all different. I had anxiety attacks when I thought about what the rest of my life would be like having to deal with this. For some reason, I was not able to stay optimistic about this, and I'm not sure why. I guess when you are in pain and locked in your house laying around with a warm washcloth on your face, you have alot of time to think. Unfortunately my thoughts were ones that now I almost can't believe. My eyes became my main focus of my life and I thought about them EVERY SECOND OF EVERY DAY. When they hurt, there was absolutely no ignoring it...not even for a moment. I was completely consumed by them and by my decision to have lasik. I honestly just wanted to die.

About a year ago, I found this site. Many of the lasik dry eye members can tell you about the first desperate private message, or emails, or even phone calls they got from me on a bad day. I remember 6-months post op calling Diana once completely hysterical because I had just come from the doctors and my schirmers test was only a 1mm. She talked me through it and gave me strength...maybe just for that day, but that is how you need to tackle things....day by day. Everyone I talked to told me the same thing.....that is was going to take time. And that even if my eyes did not get better, I was going to learn to manage, and I was going to beat the depression and anxiety, and that even though they still had to deal with their dry eyes, it was easier for them now then back in those dark early days. I thought..."sure, maybe for you...not me. I CAN'T live like this. I'm too young...I have my whole life ahead of me, and my decision to have lasik has completely ruined it". It took the joy out of EVERYTHING in my life.

Well, things are alot different now. Next week is my 17 month anniversary of lasik, and you know, I didn't even know that date of the top of my head, I actually had to stop and think, unlike that first year when I could tell you the months, days ,and hours! Unfortunately, my eyes are not better, but emotionally I am 150% better than before. That doesn't mean that I'm totally back to normal, or totally back to where I want to be, but when I compare now with this time last year, the difference is unbelievable. I certainly still have my days, I imagine we all do. Sometimes its even a week when my eyes are extra bad. My thoughts wander a bit and put me in a bad place, but it is not constant and it is not the kind of debilitating fear and anxiety I experienced early on. I actually look forward to things now...I make plans, without wondering "well what if my eyes are bad that day?" In terms of eye pain and discomfort, I can tolerate SO MUCH more than in the early days. On bad days if I'm super busy at work, or hanging out with friends or something, I can even block it out for a while. I do not think about my eyes constantly anymore. Ofcourse there are those days, when nothing is gonna help, and you just need to take some time off and rest your eyes. When that happens, I try not to get too negative about what I'm missing out on, and just think about how tomorrow will be better...if not tomorrow, the next day, etc. It is like it has kind of become a part of me. My eyes usually ALWAYS have some level of non-normalcy, and some degrees of that I ignore. When the pain comes on, I think "wow, my eyes suck today", I don't think "wow, if only I hadn't had lasik". I mean on a bad day, if a lasik ad comes on the radio, or I get one of those stupid pop-ups on the internet for lasik (you know I can't even set my fantasy football lineup in peace anymore because of those darn ads!) then I'll get a bit of the "why did I do this??" feeling. But for the most part I don't dwell on the lasik anymore, and I think letting go of that has helped me tremedously.

I go through cycles. I am not out of the woods yet, but better emotionally that I ever thought I would be, and I'm confident that I will continue to improve. In terms of my eyes, I finally found a good doctor, and am still working on different treatment options, to hopefully get myself in a state of manageability all the time. I like to be very proactive in my treatment and suggest things to my doctor. This site has been great for suggestions on different treatment options.

I know this was probably too long and boring to some of the members, but from your posts, I imagine that you are probably in a very similar place, and I thought it might be encouarging to hear first hand how someone made it out. Talking to the people on this site was one of the only things that helped when I was in my downward spiral. That and prayer. I already mentioned Diana and don't want to list out everyone else beause I know I'll accidently forget someone, but thanks guys. Some of you I talked to more than others, some of you I didn't even talk to at all, and it was just reading your posts that helped, but to everyone who helped me through even ONE HOUR of my misery in those rough early days....thanks. I cannot even put into words how much I needed everyone here, and how much you all have helped me get through this. Thanks for this site, Rebecca!! YGB, feel free to PM me if you have any other questions. Hang in there and I hope that things get better for you soon, physically and emotionally....

-Shells

**YGB** · 18-Nov-2006, 12:25

Thank you Shells!

I very much enjoyed reading your reply. I even went back to your original posts from about a year ago and feel like we are going through a very similar experience about 1 year apart. While I am sorry that your dry eye condition has not disappeared, I am very happy to hear that you have been able to move forward with your life in a much healthier way. This is just what I needed to hear.

I have been told that I need to be optimistic to help the healing process. Boy do I try to keep this approach, but dry eye can be a relentless process that makes me struggle with being able to maintain even some hope at times. Your story helps my realistic/dominant personality be better prepared that even if my DES doesn't go away during healing time, there is good hope for life with dry eye beyond 1 year, 2 years ...??? I am hopeful that once my realistic side is satiated with enough hope for a chance of life with DES, my optimistic side will finally then have an opportunity to get to work.

BTW, I am sure you have seen the documentation, but it seems like patients can see improvement from dry eye issues for a few years post-LASIK so I am hopeful that you will continue seeing even further improvement.

**Lucy** · 18-Nov-2006, 12:47

Good job, Shelley...........
BTW, Shells grew up on the Dry Eye Zone.

**shells** · 19-Nov-2006, 08:40

Originally posted by Lucy

Good job, Shelley...........
BTW, Shells grew up on the Dry Eye Zone.

Yes, with Lucy as my mom!

YGB - Wow, I went back and read some of my old posts just now too, and it reminded me even more how much progress I have made. I think part of the hopelessness before was having no idea what was going on. I saw I have posts about plugs or no plugs? drops or no drops? gel or no gel? I was TOTALLY confused back then. I realize now that our eyes just fluctuate and sometimes there is not a great explanation for it. Over the months, I've found a much better (and easier) routine than I had back then. So, although my eyes haven't really made any improvements tear production wise, I have found a better way to manage them. Also, the depression and crying all the time was certainly not helping, so now that that is out of the way (or atleast is not constant anymore), that helps them too. I know it is hard to be optimistic when your eyes hurt, but just try to come up with something...anything that will put you in a better place.

A warm bath always seemed to help me, and my eyes. I did that often, and still do on bad days. Praying also helped, and I could do that anywhere. If I was feeling alot of anxiety at work, or when I was out, even if I was in a room crowded with people, I could just pray and find a bit of peace. Praying is also easy to do with gel in your eyes and a washcloth on your face if you need to!

I hope you also find something that you can get atleast temporary comfort in, maybe listening to music, or a book on tape. You need to find something that gives you atleast a bit of sanity when first learning to deal with all of this.

-Shells

**elaine** · 19-Nov-2006, 15:04

You gotta believe

I'm enjoying reading all these supportive words. I'm sitting here with one eye shut, having a bad eye day myself. It has been 2 1/2 years for me, and I can't say I have reconciled with it, as it seems to get only worse and worse, which worries me, but I am wearing the dreaded Panptx glasses as often as possible, and trying various supplements I work out at Curves, where I open my eyes to go from machine to machine, but then can close them while I work out. I suppose other places are like that too. So I can exercise. I also go horseback riding once or twice a week, which is the one time I truly enjoy myself without thinking about my eyes. Work is getting worse for me, with overhead forced hot air heat. I have downloaded the application for books on tape through the National Library Service for the Blind and Visually Impaired. I believe I am eligible, but have to wrestle with my feelings about admitting to having a visual disability/chronic condition, not something that will go away. It is very helpful to read about how other people are coping. I do wish I could find something that would help with the pain when it gets severe, however. Hard to ignore that one! I am also trying not to talk about it to my friends as much...
Best wishes,
Elaine

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I would appreciate suggestions on how to cope with life with DES

I would appreciate suggestions on how to cope with life with DES

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