Purpose of Massage: THIN oil?

[MGD1701]

Hi
Try to figure out HOW to thin the oil?

Massage harder (after warm compress) - would this really help?
Purpose of massage: remove OLD oil and generate NEW oil, what I have read.
If so, we should massage harder? What do you guys' understanding?
However, many doctors do NOT recommend massage but squeeze lids or blink. So confusing!

Frequent warm compress, 3-4 times a day? that will only make oil flowing not thinner, I guess??

Azithromycin is effectiver than doxy?: side-effect, if more than 4 months?
Finally dr gave me 100mg/day to thin oil (not for inflammation). Will only try if I could not find better solutions.

Omega 3: can not get brands PRN/HydroEye and
hard to find quality/effective one with EPA/DHA (without ALA - causes inflammation?)
Some studies suggest Flexseeds (not in oil form) should be a good alternative??
My Omeg 3 & 6 are almost double than normal but I guess it wont hurt to increase omeg 3.

Are there other ways to thin the oil?

Thanks for sharing and help!

[CharlieGreenEyes]

About doxy. I'm been on it now for 9-10 months. 100mg a day. Don't think I get any side-effects. Haven't noticed anything different anyway. I asked about whether I needed to lower my dosage but my corneas/eyes/MGs (not sure which) were so inflammed I was told to stay on 100 for now.

I take it around the same time every day (take it in a single dose), and take it on an empty stomach (I've heard this is more effective - but if you get side effects, I was told it's fine to take with a light meal/snack or milk to help settle your stomach). I don't lie down or bend over, etc for at least 1 hour (try to make it 2 hours) after taking. Perhaps that helps me avoid side-effects? I guess it also depends just on each person - some get side-effects from various medicines, others don't.

I think the doxy has helped me. Still suffer from the dryness, MGD, whatever I have a lot - but since I started the doxy I haven't had any infections (I went through a stage of getting a stye every few weeks for a few months before that).

Do you take supplements for the Omega 3? I did try a few but money's so tight and they're so expensive (especially as I can't work without functional vision, which I only get with contact lenses, which I can only tolerate for around an hour a day). So I started to just use natural sources. I'm vegetarian so guess I'm not getting as good as I can get if I ate fish/fish oil, but I'm currently using flaxseed.

Massage - I'm confused too. Like you I've been given conflicting advice from different doctors. The most recent told me to sort of press (quite hard) - moving 1,2,3 from one side to the other just under the lids (bottom lid) and then on the lid-edge/rim at the top (hope I've explained that well enough!). But I'm a bit scared to press too hard in case I damage my corneas, get an abrasion or worse, or induce glaucoma (I had raised eye pressure a few months back although it's down to normal now).

I don't actually seem to have much oil at all. Hardly any ever comes out of my worse eye - perhaps the glands are gone, I need to ask at my next appointment. The other eye every so often has what I think is a thin oil - but very little. Whatever type of massage or compress I use. I do between 2-4 compresses a day. Doesn't seem to help with oil or anything like that - but I do find it soothing.

[MGD1701]

Hi CharlieGreenEye

Azithromycin: have you tried? seems it is more effective than Doxy: you take it for inflammation or for thining oil? If for inflammation, better try other alternatives, for example increase omeg 3 or goji berry or other natural food. I think all drugs have side effects. Dr gave me this just to thin oil. I drink green (or camomile) tea with (bio) goji and lemo seems help a bit.

Massage: One dr also asked me to massage harder. The problem is HOW we can monitor and make sure we do it correctly?
I hate to do something for NOTHING. Well, I find it is more effective when forcefully blink (about 3 min) combined with Blephasteam (warm compress), eye closed.
I can feel more oil comes out that way. It is sort like LipiFlow, I think. What do you think?

oil: are you sure not much oil or glands are clogged or boothpast-like oil? If you have scar tissue, probing helps. Have you heard of Mibo? seems effective and cheaper than IPL and LipiFlow. You can find some viedos from YouTube. I can see oil drops (upper glands only) from 20-zoom mirror. These drops some are bigger than others. Interesting!

[Hokucat]

Based on the article below, be careful not to massage too hard, especially after warm compress, or it could warp the cornea and cause vision problems.

https://www.reviewofoptometry.com/ar...rong-way-43097

I do tend to think forceful blinking after compress may be a safer option, and doing blinking exercises throughout the day to help keep the oils flowing. I used to think forced blinking was useless, but that's when all my glands were almost completely blocked and a few with very thick Crisco-like oil. Now I find it helpful.

[CharlieGreenEyes]

Thanks for the article link, Hokucat. Any concerns I express about massaging hard are always dismissed by opths whenever I ask. Perhaps I should bring the article with to my next appointment.

I already have possible corneal warping - not from massaging (although it could have added to the issue) but because I've worn rigid gas permeable lenses for over 25 years - and some of the visual problems I'm getting indicated that. My astigmatism is definitely worse if nothing else. My corneas were too damaged (from the dryness and abrasions) for a proper test last time but hopefully will have recovered enough by the next appointment.

I don't have any evidence but I can't help worrying about forceful blinking too. I got a corneal abrasion after blinking a while back. I was blinking very hard though - perhaps if you do it carefully and also perhaps I did it wrong, I don't know.

I suspect my glands might be blocked. I have almost no oil at all in my worse eye, and hardly anything in the other eye. What oil I have is thin, I think. Nothing like toothpaste. It's sort of like cooking oil but the colour of water - clear. But very little of that - and perhaps only about once every 2 weeks. Nothing at all usually.

Not heard of Azithromycin. I'm happy for now with the doxy. I'm on it for inflammation. Not sure if it's helping or not with that, but I've not had an infection (styes, similar) since I started it - and I was getting loads before. No noticeable side effects so far but perhaps I'm lucky. I'd rather not take anything drugwise if I don't have to - but I'm not willing to go back to the repeated infections I was getting. Hopefully if everything else is under control at some stage, I can stop (or at least lower the dose).

I'll have a look into Mibo and see if I can find anything out about it (not heard of it before).

Flaxseeds. I don't take oil form. I buy packets of it - and add some to my porridge or in a stew. I don't know if it helps but I'll keep taking in the hope it does. Goji berry -I must start buying this. I've had it before in a juice and liked it so if nothing else I'll enjoy the taste.

[MGD1701]

Hi Charlie

Cornea
just found this, might be of interest to you.
''Of possible concern is the heating of the cornea from approximately 36 °C to 39.4 °C after approximately 8 min.
If eye rubbing (= massage??) occurs when the corneal temperature is elevated, corneal deformation and visual blur can result. The risks of ocular massage with elevated corneal temperature have been deemed to require patient instruction on how to optimally perform the procedure.'' someone was kind enough to post the link yesterday http://www.theocularsurfacejournal.c...114-3/fulltext

Any thoughs? forcefully blinking would be safer?? 2 doctors said I should massage intead of blinking.
I think in-office expression would NOT make the oil thinner, right?

If you have problem with cornea. maybe squeeze (lids), as suggested by Dr Korb, inventor of LipiFlow, is better.

Omeg 3: should help you with respect to oil quality and inflammation. quality fish oil supplement is expensive. seems flaxseeds oil form (cold pressed and bio) is a good alternative. Good to do your own research too. Dr John Hovanesian suggested (in his old article) Flax Seed Oil - 1,000 mg, 1-3 times/day, for your info.

Styes: wet heat compress and lid scrubs help me with this.

[Hokucat]

Charlie, given it sounds like you don't have much tear film and oil, likely not much benefit for you to do forced blinking. Plus it sounds like any unusual movement could cause erosions, so better to refrain. When your eyes get better and you have more moisture, assuming the oils have increased, it may beneficial then, but would first put in preservative-free eye drops or saline before blinking.

[MGD1701]

After doing a bit of research, my treatment plans to thin the oil will be:
1) increase flaxseed oil (bio, cold pressed)

2) massage/express harder
(I just came up with an idea to apply eye ointment around eyes and express with a small cute plastic kitcheware)
which works more effective than q-tip and fingers.) Mibo treatment inspires me this.

4) more compress (x3/day from x2)

I tried above 1 day and my eyes are super good today - only needed 1 drop/systance balance.
Any comments? Thanks!

[CharlieGreenEyes]

After doing a bit of research, my treatment plans to thin the oil will be:
1) increase flaxseed oil (bio, cold pressed)

2) massage/express harder
(I just came up with an idea to apply eye ointment around eyes and express with a small cute plastic fork
which works more effective than q-tip and fingers.) Mibo treatment inspires me this.

4) more compress (x3/day from x2)

I tried above 1 day and my eyes are super good today - only needed 1 drop/systance balance.
Any comments? Thanks!

I can't help feeling nervous about the idea of a fork - in case you damage your corneas like cause an abrasion. Maybe I'm just being over-cautious though - and if it has helped you, that's great! I guess a plastic fork shouldn't be too dangerous so perhaps I'll try it (gently at first).

I've tried flaxseed oil before. I started buying the flaxseeds in packet form purely because it was cheaper - the oil bottles I was getting had very short use-by dates once opened. I might alternate - sometimes splash out and buy the oil but sometimes go cheap with the packets.

I've started having tumeric everyday - partly for general health benefits, but also for possible anti-inflammatory effects. Also having garlic everyday.

[CharlieGreenEyes]

Charlie, given it sounds like you don't have much tear film and oil, likely not much benefit for you to do forced blinking. Plus it sounds like any unusual movement could cause erosions, so better to refrain. When your eyes get better and you have more moisture, assuming the oils have increased, it may beneficial then, but would first put in preservative-free eye drops or saline before blinking.

Thanks. I think you're right. I seem to have almost no oil at all - and not much tear film. I'm doing the massage - but gently, for now.

[MGD1701]

Hi Charlie
Dont be nervous. Of course, I just use the handel - not the sharp fork. You can use anything you find useful.
Flaxseed: seems oil is more effective and take it 3 times a day.

Gamma linolenic acid, GLA, studies show it is good/effective for MGD
i.e. borage oil, evening primrose oil, black currant

Garlic: I cut it very fine and leave it for about 15 min. and eat it raw (with vegetables), as it is more effective, what I have read.

Glad you are trying new things. Good luck!

Do you have inflammation issue? If so, effective/safe lid cleaners is important. I have found and tried Avenova alternative with pure HOCI, made in UK (very attractive price) which helps me surprisingly great - I do not suffer watering and discharges for nearly 3 weeks. The beauty of it is to avoid antiobics and it does not generate bacterial resistance, according to doctors.
More please read. http://www.dryeyezone.com/talk/forum...va-alternative