eye problem?

[Amy09]

i have a very random question that may or may not be related to my eye problems, so bear with me. Sometimes I get ocular migraines, which is where everything i see seems to go black and all i see are bright flickering lights for an hour or so. I've always assumed that this was related to general eye strain that I get from dry eye and SLK, because i have never had problems with regular migraines, and it's usually rare that i even get minor headaches. The ocular migraines happen very rarely though (usually only a couple times a year) and as i said, they usually go away within an hour, so i don't feel like it is anything to worry about.

recently though, i have been having very bad problems with vertigo. I am eating and sleeping enough, but throughout the day, almost everyday, everything starts spinning, i get very dizzy, and my eye sight gets very weird. it's hard for me to focus my eyesight on anything when this happens. this occurs even when i am sitting down, laying in bed, etc. does anyone think this could related to my eye problems as well, or is it just some other random thing that i should get checked out? like i said, i'm eating and sleeping enough, and the only prescription medicine that i take is restasis, so i don't think it is related to medication, but the vertigo is occuring enough everyday that it is bothering me a little.

[NYer]

Vertigo

Amy, I cannot address the ocular migrane issue but I am, unfortunately, something of an expert when it comes to some forms of vertigo.

I have a recurring condition called "Benign Paroxsysmal Positional Vertigo", also known as "BPPV". It's actually very common but most people who get it only get it once and never get it again. Some of us get it off and on and I'm one of those people. But most people, when they do get it, find it very scarey because they have no idea why the room is spinning and they think they're having a stroke.

BPPV is an inner-ear condition and is not related to dry eye. The only relationship to the eyes is that when you are having a vertigo spin, the part of your brain that tells your eyes where to focus gets all confused because the inner ear is telling it the wrong thing and it causes a temporary condition in your eyes called "nystagmus". If a doctor looks really closely at your eyes during a vertigo spin, he or she will see your eyeballs either twirling in little circles or shaking back and forth side to side (yes, really, it's weird).

I'll give you a link here to read more about BPPV so this doesn't get too long, as it's unrelated to dry eye...but there is one key point to be able to tell if your vertigo is BPPV or some other sort of vertigo:

BPPV vertigo spins are set off by the movement of your head (affecting the direction of your inner ear). If you get vertigo when you do one of the following, then you probably have it:
1. sit up or stand up from laying down
2. lay down from sitting or standing
3. Roll over to your other side while you're laying down
4. tilt your head back while you're standing up (i.e., to water your hanging plants or to get something off of a high shelf) (or you are embracing your lover who kisses you and you tilt your head back during the kiss...you may think you're swooning when you get dizzy but you're actually having a vertigo spin!)
5. turn your head from side to side (i.e., shaking your head "no" or driving and turning your head to see behind you before changing lanes.

If this sort of movement is not what sets off your vertigo, then you have some other sort of vertigo or dizziness. If it is what sets it off, you most likely have BPPV.

There is a lot of information on the web about it and it is also astounding how many doctors are not familiar with it and, even if they are, how many of them do not know the right way to get rid of it. Whatever you do, do not take motion sickness medication for it, which is what lots of docs will throw at you. It just makes you really tired and doesn't help anything. There is a physical maneuver that you can do yourself or a doctor can help you with that helps a lot and that's the best way to stop the vertigo. OK, enough talking...here's a good link for you. I hope you can find out what the story is with the migranes. If you do, please let us know more about that.

http://www.tchain.com/otoneurology/d...bppv/bppv.html

[Lucy]

I didn't read NYer's post, but obviously she has some good info there. In a word, this could also be connected to inner ear problems. You need to follow up with your doc(s). My sisters have Meinere's (sp) disease and vertigo and/or spinning are a big part of it. Amy, good luck to you and get on to your doctor. Lucy

[IanJ]

Hi,

I get eye migraines, they manifest themselves as white dots around my centre of vision. They appear very randomly and last anything from 2 minutes to a couple of hours. I only started getting them ever since I developed dry eyes.

The eye docs said they are nothing to worrk about.....just a little frightening sometimes.

Ian.

[NYer]

Amy, this stuff got me thinking and I googled "ocular migraines" and I found this site:

http://thedizzylounge.com/thedizzy_f...ead.php?t=5835

and judging by some of the comments there, there most certainly DOES seem to be a link between vertigo and the ocular migraines.

What's also very interesting to me is that after looking at another site that describes ocular migraines and shows pictures of what the aura looks like, I realized that I have had ocular migraines, too!

Here's that site:
http://www.perret-optic.ch/optometri..._ophtalmic.gif

Wow...so after having posted that info back to help you with info about vertigo, I thought you should know that you really helped me a lot by putting up that post about vertigo and ocular migraines!! I actually tried to describe that symptom to Dr. Latkany when I saw him a few weeks ago and he didn't have a clue what I was referring to. I didn't know it was an ocular migraine. Now I know what that was.

So since we both have dry eye AND the vertigo and ocular migraine symptoms, maybe there is a link to dry eye here. I'm going to see him again in 4 weeks and I'll ask him about this and keep you updated.

Where would we all be without this DEZ site?

[calli66]

I have an ocular migraine once or twice a month---since childhood, really. My dad had them, too. Eye doctors will tell you they are harmless, except that they can impede vision for about 10 minutes (this happens to me). I get the "auras"--the scintillating multi-colored arcs and castellation visual forms. They usually start right in the center of my visual field, then gradually expand outward radially as they dissipate.

I didn't read the links above posted by NYer, but I know that it is a sort of spasm of the optic blood vessels, is usually benign, and that there are "triggers" that bring it on. These are different for each person. My triggers are food stimulant and blood sugar related. I can get an ocular migraine from eating very sweet foods on an empty stomach---not sugar---but medjool dates, for example. I can get one if I drink coffee on an empty stomach----sometimes even if I eat something normal, like breakfast cereal. But somehow it's related to a chemical change that takes place when the food hits my empty stomach.

Calli

[NYer]

Calli, thank you for that info. I'm fascinated because I have Type 2 Diabetes, so obviously there's some really relevent issues here based on what you described. I haven't seen a food correlation but I wasn't looking for one either, since I had no idea what was going on. I will watch that carefully now, though.
Have you noticed any correlation between the state of your dry eye and the ocular migranes?

[dryeyes2]

Interesting

This is an interesting topic. I have had problems with migraines with auras on and off for many years. I too have also had just the ocular migraine and I have had BPPV. I have had problems with BPPV twice. When it goes away, I notice I need to be careful not to go to far with my head to the left or too far back (like in a dentist's chair). I don't want to set it off again. BPPV is about the worst dizziness I can imagine. My husband had it once, and my dad had it. There are exercises you can do help get it under control. I usually only do them when I have had the condition going on. There are also ear doctors that do certain exercises that help move the crystals in your ear in a way so they don't cause problems.

I am not sure how they would all interconnect with dry eye, but I will be interested in reading about it.

dryeyes2

[NYer]

Yes, that's called the Epley Maneuver, which is described in one of the links I put in above. You can do it yourself or you can have the doctor do it. I don't find it works to well on my own. Also, you have to have a doctor who really knows how to do it right. I went to two ear doctors who thought they knew it but didn't. Then I went to a neurologist (who specialized in balance) and he got it right.
This is fascinating to me that there is a tie-in between BPPV, ocular migranes, and dry eye. Looks like we're onto something!

[calli66]

Have you noticed any correlation between the state of your dry eye and the ocular migranes?

No, I haven't noticed a correlation. I was having ocular migraines long before dry eyes became a problem. I think I have fewer at this of my life (I'm 58). But then, I am extremely vigilant about foods---I don't drink coffee any more, or eat dairy, or gluten (or a lot of other stuff that I won't bore people with the details). I still get the ocular migraines, but they seem less intense, and have a shorter duration.

I always thought there was some correlation between being very nearsighted (me) and this phenomenon---but that opinion has absolutely no basis in scientific fact. I think of it as extra stress on the retina and optic nerve due to my lengthened eyeball.

Calli

[Amy09]

it's good to know that this seems harmless and that it is nothing too big to worry about. i do feel that the ocular migranes are linked to dry eye. i never had one in my life until a few years ago, when i really started to have problems w/ dry eye. i'm guessing that it is partly from the eye strain that comes from dry eye. i have to go to the doctor for a yearly check up in a couple weeks, so i might mention the dizziness thing to him while i am there since, unlike ocular migraines, they don't seem to be directly connected to eye problems.

[Lucy]

Hi Amy,
Perhaps I'm not "in tune" with the rest of the posters. I think this sounds way to serious to be discussing on this board (or any other) without seeing your physician(s).

it's good to know that this seems harmless and that it is nothing too big to worry about. i do feel that the ocular migranes are linked to dry eye. i never had one in my life until a few years ago, when i really started to have problems w/ dry eye. i'm guessing that it is partly from the eye strain that comes from dry eye. i have to go to the doctor for a yearly check up in a couple weeks, so i might mention the dizziness thing to him while i am there since, unlike ocular migraines, they don't seem to be directly connected to eye problems.

I certainly hope this is "harmless" but how do you know unless you have this seriously looked into? The thread talks about everything from ocular migranes, vertigo, blood sugar, type 2 diabetes, dry eye, retina, optical nerve! Unless I'm mistaken, none of the posters are physicians. As one who has had two bouts of cancer within the past year, diagnosed 4 days apart, you should not ignore such serious things.

Lucy

[Rebecca Petris]

Echoing Lucy here.

Not foreboding anything bad, just concerned. It's great to get feedback from others from their shared experiences but I think the key role of that info sharing should be to give us more direction/ammo for pursuing better diagnosis. There's always danger here of slipping into 'internet diagnosis' mode and it makes me nervous.

[dryeyes2]

migraines

I have to agree with Rebecca and Lucy. I have read that migraine with aura (I believe this would include ocular migraine because basically that is the aura without necessarily getting the headache) may increase someone's chance of a having a stroke. So it isn't necessarily a benign thing that should be taken lightly.

Best wishes,
dryeyes2

[NYer]

I agree that if someone has any of these conditions, they should be seen by a doctor for an actual diagnosis. However, much of this discussion has simply been among people who have already been diagnosed with specific conditions who are noticing a common thread between a few different conditions that it turns out we all have. Until now, I never would have drawn a link between BPPV (which is benign - hence the "B") and dry eye and ocular migranes. Now I have some very specific questions to address to my doctor, which I certainly didn't have before.

Understand that the idea is for people to compare notes here and get a bit of an education from each other's history...and then go to the doctor "armed" as an educated patient. No one is diagnosing anyone else here and suggesting that they take our histories as a diagnosis of their condition.

A perfect example is where the type of vertigo that I have is BPPV...which is benign. But as Lucy pointed out, her sisters have Meinere's disease - a condition which causes very similar symptoms to what I have but which is a different condition and has different problems associated with it. So, someone reading this who has vertigo now understands that it can be a few different conditions, and they have some information on how to tell which one it probably is, and they can now go see their doctor with some good information about their symptoms.

No one should take advice, even from one of the professionals who might be on this or any other bulletin board, as a diagnosis of their own medical issues. But it's an excellent source of education and information.