What would convince eye doctor about Dwelle?

[calli66]

I've had good success with FreshKote, and Rojzen and other people-- with Dwelle. I've shown the package, the insert, and the product to my different eye doctors, and they usually make this comment: "I just don't see how this product is different from any of the other OTC eyedrops/tears on the market." And I can't explain it to them; I just don't have the facts on the tip of my tongue, even though I've read Dr. Holly's articles.

I recommended these drops to my friend with Sjogren's, who suffers terribly with her eyes, and she gave the info to her doctor who had the same reply. I still believe they are superior drops, but what simple explanation can I give?

Calli

[Rojzen]

"more about physics than about chemistry"

Hi Calli, and please know that I feel your pain over doctors not being willing to give Dr. Holly's drops a serious look. As I've recently written, here, I have printed out several of Dr. Holly's writings and handed these to an eye doctor, only to have him take the papers and stuff them right into my file, without looking at them first.

On the other hand, I have succeeded with one local doctor, in this, by scheduling an actual coffee with him, and bringing him a bottle of Dwelle, a bottle of FreshKote, (with inserts), and printouts of several items from Dr. Holly's organization's web site. This doctor had seen me 10 years ago, when I was terribly desperate, and unable to go outdoors and drive, on my own, just to get to appointments. He had not been able to help, and he remembered the dire-ness of that situation. It was this doctor who had the good sense and compassion to read the Dr. Holly materials, and then to proceed to add the Dr. Holly drops to his arsenal. It is probably not a coincidence that this is an optometrist, rather than ophthalmologist.

I am not sure this optometrist is using Dwelle much, alas, but he has remained in touch with me on it. Also, I have made sure to send friends his way, to reinforce in him the awareness that scientifically based solutions are in demand, and must be used. He benefits, and, I hope, the patients then benefit.

Still, we are not far along enough in getting the word out on Dwelle, in particular. I am going to try to make my case for Dwelle in a few months again, with a dynamic young ophthalmologist new to the dry eye scene in my area. I'll watch this thread, in meantime, for ideas on how I can succeed in getting her to read the materials I bring.

Sometimes doctors want to see very conventional-looking clinical trials on a product before they'll look at it. And then they will even wait 'till the smartly dressed pharmaceutical rep. shows up with samples of the tested product. I believe these developments are in the works for the Dr. Holly products, but it sure hurts emotionally to know that our doctors won't take their patients' word for it that Dwelle and related products function COMPLETELY uniquely, and bear little resemblance to other drops.

What I emphasize, whenever I advocate, is that Dwelle is more about PHYSICS than about CHEMISTRY. And then I cross fingers that the doctor I'm addressing actually liked science before s/he went to medical/professional school. . .

[irish eyes]

Hi Calli

Living in the UK, I have had to obtain Dwelle from the US; I simply hadn't been able to find any suitable drops since my problems started several years ago. Freshkote is now available in the UK but it is licensed under the name Clinitas Ultra. Sadly, that didn't help my eyes either. I started Dwelle at the weekend and I'm beginning to feel a bit better already. (I even look better)

The point I wish to make is that I too have found doctors to be rather dismissive of anything new when I put it to them. Perhaps they see it as a challenge to their authority - and if they don't know about it then it mustn't be worth knowing. A bit harsh perhaps but that's my impression.

My local eye dept adopt a scattergun approach in prescribing drops; believing that if they get people to try all of them, then something might work eventually. Sadly, they seem to see one case of DES as being exactly like another and of course it isn't. One of the younger consultants admitted that he found the `Cornea Clinic Days' the most depressing because he met so many despairing people and there was `nothing' more he could do for them. There's certainly a lot of work to do here in the UK.

[stella]

I am giving clinitas ultra 3 a 6 month trial ( my own experiment ) 'cos of the success stories above
I would prefer it to be Dwelle - but i am from UK - and have the same problem of availability as irisheyes
I have been using clinitas now for about 6 weeks - the first few i mixed with my old drops which i dont think gave it a proper chance
this last couple of weeks i have stuck to clinitas only and my eyes have improved slightly eyes espcially in am after sleeping(i still use antibiotic ointment on lid margins after lid hygiene last thing at night)
My analysis is that the clinitas is a bit irritating to the lids ,but definately improves the eye surface
It burns a bit on instilation but that passes quickly and i can tolerate it
I think my lids need one thing and the eyes themselves need another if that makes sense

[irish eyes]

Stella

I was OK with Clinitas for a few days and then it irritated the lids too much. Dwelle settles on the lids also but so far it hasn't made the lids any worse than they already are.

Your point about your eyes needing one thing and the lids needing another makes perfect sense. My lids were horrendously sore last night, particularly the left one. This morning they don't look as bad as I thought they would look, considering that the discomfort was bad enough to keep me awake. I cannot blame it on Dwelle because they have been like this for a few weeks now - before I started using it. I hope Clinitas works for you.

[stella]

Hi Irish eyes
,why dont you try chloramphenicol eye ointment(available OTC) at night on lid margins only (minimal amount put on with a q tip- like eyeliner) then smear your outside lids with vasaline ) That has really helped my lids

[irish eyes]

Hi again Stella

Did you find buying chloranphenicol an easy thing to do?

On your suggestion, I thought I should try chloranphenicol. The girl in Boots the Chemist put me through `a set of questions' so she could determine whether I should buy it or not. But - I got the answer to one of her questions WRONG. She became vey pompous and refused to sell it to me. At which point, I asked what I should have said to get the answer right - and she told me.

I got it in the end so I will try it out tonight.

[eva b]

I am following this thread with great interest, since stella and irisheyes (hello to both of you) seem to have very similar problems to my own.

i.e. the eyelids need different specific treatment to the eyes themselves.

FOr me, I've pretty much established that it's my lids which cause me the most grief...as long as I can keep the MGD relatively controlled (with compresses and expression) the lids aren't as sore.

All drops I've ever tried MAY have improved the surface of the eye itself...but all have aggravated the lids.

It really is a complex scenario, as one of you said in her post, as we are all different and the causes of our DES are threrefore different.

I also sympathise with the experience with the pharmacist...they can, indeed, get dreadfully pompous - particularly in Boots I find, maybe it's part of their training. After all, if a medication is available OTC, then they don't really have the right to refuse to sell it to you!

[stella]

Hi Irisheyes and Eva B !
In answer to your question - No it was not easy to buy over the counter
Optrex does "infected eyes" drops and that is chloramphenicol(other name is chloramycetin) 1% in mineral oil and Boots do that ,as do superdrug(i think) ,failing that most other pharmacies

I have to explain that i get mine on Rx 'cos i seem to be allergic to the mineral oil and the NHS version of this is made by Medicom and is in soft white parrafin/liquid parrafin which is better for me
My GP and i get along well - and to tell you the truth she is at a loss to know how to help me over my eyes ,so is quite relieved if i come up with a new idea, and on this one she goes along with me, so i have a repeat Rx now

I use vasaline on the outer lids - the reason for that is that from the beginning i always felt my lids were sooo dry (like dry skin, and scratchy)At first i tried cosmetic lid creams which i mostly reacted to
Then when i started the chloramphenicol ointment for the eyes (first prescribed for me 'cos i developed a chalazion) To my amazement this felt very soothing to my lids - so very cautiously i used it on the margins ,next i smeared it on the outer lids, and it felt great !

After several months doing this i became anxious that i was overdoing the antibiotic ointment (I must say at that point i asked my GP about resistance to it due to overuse)She told me she had been speaking to an ophthalmologist and he had said that chloramphenicol eye ointment had been proven in the lab to have 0% effect on bacteria , so she concluded in the light of this info that my relief was due to the emolient effect rather then the anti -bacterial effect
All this made me think i would try plain vasaline on my outer lids , but i did not want to use vasaline on the margins in case i was "plugging " the mebomian gland ducts - so i continued with the chloamphenicol ointment since i reconed that it was specifically for the eyes and therefore would not block the ducts

Sorry for long explanation - but i thought you might like to follow my "logic" on this