anyone take bio dentical hormones for dry eye? ladies?

[jenny2008]

i was just curious-i have sjogrens and mgd... would taking bio identical hormones help or hurt my dry eye? any experiences?

[DCRdryeye]

Hi Jenny, bioidentical hormones are not just for ladies. In fact I have just been issued with a prescription for a testosterone and chrysin mix of bioidenticals to boost my systemic testosterone levels. Before commencing, it's compulsory to have a blood test for various cancers, mainly due to the literature that suggests testosterone can influence prostate cancer, etc (and new research suggest testosterone does NOT contribute to prostate cancer). If tests are clear, I can beging the treatment.

It's important you have a full panel test of every hormone you can, both by saliva and blood. There's usually bound to be deficiencies or over production of certain hormones. When you know what the problem is, the solution is easy.

[LaDiva]

I have a saliva kit to do, but am waiting awhile. Just started taking a gamut of vitamins which are in part supposed to boost a balance of hormone production, so I want to wait on the test. I've been taking bio-identical estrogen and progesterone, and they did not help my dry eyes. I had blood tests done last year, which were not very conclusive, and they were done in the early morning. I understand the saliva test can more accurately measure your hormonal changes throughout the day as you take saliva samples morning, afternoon, late afternoon and evening. I think there are other things measured as well. Your hormone levels supposedly drop during the day, so when I had blood tests done, my hormone levels were likely at their highest point. Some say the blood test tells a better story, others say saliva, some say you should use both. The saliva test is not covered by my insurance and it costs $325. You will probably need to see a compounding pharmacist to get a saliva kit, and will need an OK from your doctor. The saliva kit takes gallons of saliva, so be prepared.

[sunshinelover]

How do you do the saliva test? I am thinking of ordering one.

[LaDiva]

Hi Sunshine,
I got mine from a compounding pharmacy. They contact your doctor first, and then you can buy the kit. There are 3 vials about 2 inches long and one vial about 3 inches. You spit into the tubes, and I was told to fill each tube 3/4 full. You can fill the tubes over a two day period, and do not have to do them all in one day, but need to make sure on the second day that the saliva goes into the same tube you used the day before at the same time of day. There are more directions about not eating first, hormone supplements, etc. There are different tests. Some only require a couple of tubes, and some more. The kit I have also tests cortisol levels. The pharmacist recommended the four tube test because she said it gives a more complete picture of what your hormone profile looks like during the course of an entire day, and I guess it can really fluctuate. Hope this helps.

[jenny2008]

thanks for the replies... that is too bad teh hormones dont help your eyes..keep me posted LaDiva on your testing you are doing... I dont know if I would have enough saliva to do that type of testing with my dry mouth!

[jenny2008]

LaDiva ..please keep us posted... that stinks the hormones dont help your dryness..not sure i could do the saliva testing tho with my mouth dryness from sjogrens...hmmmm... let me know how much more accurate this test if for you and good luck!!!

[DCRdryeye]

Hi all, it's not necessarily a fact that the hormones don't assist with dry eyes. There is plenty of research proven they assist in the secretion of lacrimal gland fluid and meibomian gland release. We just need a few controlled studied "done in the correct way" to prove it further. If you put a bioidentical progesterone cream on your inner wrist (is it the correct strength?, did you apply enough? - correct dosage is vital and are you following the lunar candendar?). On the other hand (I'm not sure of your age), if you're menopausal, get your testosterone levels checked. If they are too low, the compounding pharmacy will mix testosterone into the progesterone mix too . I've seen women use bioidentical hormones then have their blood checked a few short months later and their hormones have significantly increased to normal level. They work, and they work quickly. Since they are systemic they WILL reach your eyes and all it's associated glands.
Furthermore, if you attend the correct clinic they won't just test the basic Progesterone, Estradiol, , Testosterone and hopefully Free Testosterone but a gamut of other vital hormones (eg: Androstenedione, Pregnenalone, Estriol, Estrone, E2 + E3, DHEA, SHBG, Cortisol (taken every 4 hours), DHT, Free T3, Free T4, Thyroid antibodies, P4/E2 ratio, Melatonin, etc...along with amino acids, vitamins and minerals and the proteins that carry them along the blood stream.
Jenny you don't need much saliva to collect a sample. Just a small 5ml vial is enough and you don't need to completely fill it. I have dry mouth too and I did it. Imagine biting into a sour lemon and it will soon stimulate some saliva for you
Interestingly, the Doctor who prescribed me the bioidentical hormone cream used to suffer from dry eyes himself. He said that one day he went off his DHEA for one week and noticed a chalazion develop on a meibomian gland. Upon comencement of the DHEA again, it disappeared. Certainly food for thought.

[sunshinelover]

Hi DCR, that is interesting what you said about your doc! Did he say he cured his dry eyes with DHEA? I guess if hormones work or not is due to the fact if the reason for dry eye is hormone related or not, not all are of course.
I wish docs could be more interested in this. I took a hormone test at my gyno, and it showed very high esterogen and very low testosteron (free testosteron) and very high SHBG. I am in perimenopause I would guess. But since I am a woman, the only thing of interest is if the testosteron is to high!! So what to do... I think I will order a saliva test and do the tests myself, although expensive. I have started progesteron cream, but it is difficult to know the right amount there. I think I also have a lot of symtoms as for low thyroid function but tests are normal. I have a somewhat controversial doc who has prescribed cortisol to me since he beleives in this adrenal fatigue, reveresed T3 thing etc, but I stopped taking them when I read that it can be hard to get out of it later...
Would love to try testosteroncream or drops, but seams impossible to et in Sweden. I have a friend who had her ovaries taken away recently and her doc said that testosterone is no longer procribed to women in Sweden at all....

Did you get your hormones in order to treat dry eye? What diagnose have you got?

[LaDiva]

I just read that compounding pharmacies are great places to go if you want to balance your hormones. They can create custom amounts to suit your individual needs, whereas tablets made by the large pharmaceuticals have set dose amounts, and cannot be fine-tuned. Good luck to everyone. I think testosterone is probably the key for some of us.

[sunshinelover]

I think so too, but impossible in this country- Can you go and get it in the US without even prescription?

[LaDiva]

In the USA we need a prescription from the doctor.

[littlemermaid]

'Non-SS DES is mostly found in postmenopausal women, women who are pregnant, women who are taking oral contraceptives, or women who are on hormone replacement therapy (especially estrogen-only pills). The common denominator is a decrease in androgens, either from reduced ovarian function (in postmenopausal women) or from increased levels of the sex hormone–binding globulin (in women who are pregnant or are taking birth control pills).

Androgens are believed to be trophic for the lacrimal and meibomian glands. They also exert potent anti-inflammatory activity through the production of transforming growth factor beta (TGF-β), suppressing lymphocytic infiltration.'

http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1210417-overview 'Dry Eye Syndrome', Stephen Foster for Medscape

I could really do with some more reading on this, if anyone's got any. The dermatologist is talking about putting my teenage daughter (mgd and rosacea since age 11y) on a contraceptive pill to try to control the skin (periorificial acne rosacea). But she is clueless which pill and can't test hormones so I'm not allowing this. But the derms are agreed that puberty testosterone or DHEA causes the sebum problems. Hmm.

[spmcc]

In my opinion, there is a huge difference between (1) systemically increasing hormone levels and (2) applying hormone drops to the eyes or hormone creams to the eyelids (which are *not* meant to increase systemic hormone levels).

I don't know what the answer is for us, but I think it's important to consider these as two separate, distinct issues.

[LaDiva]

Right on, spmcc. The pharmacist told me systemic is much cheaper than drops, but the pharmacy can make drops as well. I do agree with you. I am trying a number of different things, all natural, and am waiting to see if they work or not. My health has become increasingly worse since developing severe dry eye, and I do think the two are a grand announcement of something bigger going on inside. I noticed Colin said the same thing about declining health in a recent post. I feel like there are too many layers of artificial garbage gumming up my system and that things have stagnated. For anyone who might be interested, although this is slightly off the point, I quit eating gluten about three months ago, and when the Dr. checked my cholesterol, it was half what it measured the last time and triglycerides were 1/3 of their former count. If all goes well, I hope to be rid of cholesterol medication soon, and hope that might help the eyes too. Jenny, I will keep you posted. I don't know much about SS, so sorry to not be able to help more specifically.