IPL with Dr Toyos

[amyk]

I have also been told that 90% of my glands are blocked or atrophied, and that compresses/massage may be useless. However, they get worse if I stop compresses/massage, so at least some glands must be doing something. I could use some more though!

I have never had them manually expressed, but one doctor supposedly scraped caps off of blocked glands by rubbing the margins with a dry qtip. He advised me to do that as part of the daily routine. I do not notice a difference in lid margin appearance or how my eyes feel after this, however (except for irritation). If doctors can get them unblocked after manual expression and/or the IPL procedure, how do we keep them unblocked? Are warm compresses/massage once or twice a day enough?

Autumn, do your eyes feel the same as they did right after the IPL, or have they changed? I may give it a try in a few weeks (assuming I am a candidate) and am awaiting a call back from the office.

[autumnn]

I wonder how many of us have glands as severely blocked as mine are. Most of my eye docs either said they were somehwat blocked or not producing enough oil. One doctor offered to mannually express my glands which would have included numbing the lids, clamping them with something and manually forcing the oil out/unblocking the glands. He was going to do this on both the upper and lower lids. I said "no" at the time because most docs were saying my glands looked okay. Now I wonder if I should have taken his offer more seriously and maybe even have my upper lids expressed at some point and time since Dr. Toyos does just the lowers.
Has anyone had procedures done to their lids that have opened the glands?
Anyway, this MGD is sure complicated.

[autumnn]

Hi Sazy- Just a thought- have you considered going to the Tennessee clinic- it is not as far away from you....Also, I am about 45 minutes from Beverly Hills (South) and there are tons of different areas in between- some nice some not so nice. It would take some effort to really look and try to find something that will do for while you are here- wait! maybe you could take a class at USC or UCLA and live in their dorms for cheap? In the meantime I will keep my ears perked for anyone needing a roomate. Maybe someone on this forum lives nearby and can lend you a room. Anyone???
As far as how long it takes to see improvements....well, I read somewhere that the tengelesia a month after the initial treatment is significantly decreased and the glands start becoming less inflammed. Maybe improvements start after that? Sometimes I feel like it is already helping me a little bit but I still have some burning in the left eye- I am cautious to say it is less- but it might really be- might right eye is good enough to forget about most of the day.
I called today and moved my appointment up so that it is three weeks (May 14th!) from the last appointment. My apologies- he is not doing Mon and Tues- he is doing Thurs and Fri. I thought I needed to wait four weeks or more but the receptionist said three was OK. Sazy did you hear this as well- the ability to do them 3 weeks apart? I dont want to do anything to screw this up.
BTW, I am jonesing for my steam and compresses- I still cant understand why I am supposed to abandon them until he says otherwise

[EllMitcho]

Hey all,

Just to say this thread is amazing! I have been away from my computer for a while and this is just great to come back to! The procedure sounds promising (let's not get carried away I suppose but it DOES seem to make sense theoretically) - but most of all the time and effort to post such detailed accounts of the visit is just great!

Thanks - I will be watching this with interest

EllMitcho

[sazy123]

Odydnas- Dr. Toyos treated the outer eyelid margin not inside the lids but I assume that the light reaches deep into the tissue and probably into the inner eyelid. I am not sure when I am supposed to see results- I would imagine that it would take a few treatments? I am kind of on uncharted water here so I am not sure. I hope that soon he can treat skin that is darker.

Regarding the inner eyelids i am hoping that it does penetrate deep so it reaches them as well, the fact you have to where a metal eye guards suggests it does/can. I know with my inner eyelids i have dilated blood vessels, not sure about tangelsia.

[sazy123]

Thanks autumn! Is there anywhere cheap near where you live? as in that case it would be easy to go together.

Im not sure yet but i think the best thing for me to do is to come out for a couple of days for the first appointment then come home, as i have uni at the moment... then ill be free from uni over the summer, but i have a job (but its with my mum) so i think it would be possible to come for a month with the next two treatments three weeks apart..... by the third treatment i should know if its going to help... so if it does i will stay or come back, then im back at uni in September (if im still there by then) so i may have to just come back for a few days if i need 5/6 treatments, which im happy to do if it does help. In terms of doing an au pair, im not sure how i will cope with my eyes...

I know though after the second treatment if there's no difference i will probably become demotivated, and i think you need motivation to travel that far when your eyes are bad! Did he say that you should notice a difference after the second treatment if its going to help? or that you may not notice anything till the third?

I don't think hes very reliable with emails, he got back to me the first time but didn't respond to my follow up email, he must be really busy and get tons of emails. Best thing to do is ask him as much as possible when you see him.

The other thing is i also have plugs which do not help, does he irrigate them out or does he leave them in for the treatment?

[Stanza]

autumn

brilliant stuff, I do hope it helps you.

like phillip also interested if he has any collegues in other parts of the world that may start using this. sounds great.

S

[autumnn]

Odydnas- He treated the outer eyelid margin not inside the lids but I assume that the light reaches deep into the tissue and probably into the inner eyelid. I am not sure when I am supposed to see results- I would imagine that it would take a few treatments? I am kind of on uncharted water here so I am not sure. I hope that soon he can treat skin that is darker.

[odydnas]

Irisheyes...I completely understand how you feel. My grandpa called me the other day telling me how he has been diagnosed with DE too and we now share the same affliction.. He "didn't even know he had it" and now he's supposed to use artificial eye drops 3x a day, and why "don't I give that a try".....sigh....

Autumn, I'm so glad to hear your skin looks better! Has your eyes felt better yet? I don't know if its too early to ask since I'm not sure when you're supposed to feel relief. Also I was wondering, did he treat the telangenctasis on the eyelid margin...or in your inner eyelids? I have a TON of them when I pull down my lower eyelid to see....not really any on my eyelid margins. I'm trying to understand where you all mean, when you talk about telangctasis. Thanks! Keep us updated!

I will probably email Dr. Toyos after I hear your results. I live in Northern Ca, so it's not a big deal traveling down there for me. The problem is, my skin type is a 3 or 4. I will ask Dr. Toyos when he thinks he will get figure how to treat people with darker skin.

[bernmee]

Forgot about the mercury in wild salmon. Any fish that grows large holds toxins in it's body.

I read somewher that trout, a small fish, has more Omega's than salmon...you might want to look into that.

Bernadette

[autumnn]

Hi Sazy- I live about an hour away from the clinic- maybe we could even schedule our treatments on the same dates. The clinic is in a very fancy part of Beverly Hills so I am not sure where cheap accommodations would be- there are some AMAZING hotels within walking distance (ah, the luxuries of being rich)- at least afterwards we can sit at a fancy street cafe and enjoy lunch and taking in the sights.....So, for a place to live, I am sure that if you did some research there would be something in other nearby neighborhoods. Perhaps you could rent a room for a few months from a family or someone needing roomates? You can look on Craigs list as there are often people renting places for the summer- just be as careful as possible because there are some weirdos out there! You could rent anywhere within an hour south of the clinic to anywhere in LA. I can help you to get there- especially because it is only once a month! We will try to schedule you on Mondays, that is when I am off work. Would you come out for four months- have you emailed him about scheduling the treatments closer together? Anyhow, this time of year is beautiful in Southern California- it might be a nice break for you.....maybe you could even pick up some part time work (au pair?), who knows- lounging on the beach or exploring LA might be a better option. If this treatment is the answer I know it will all be worth it for you. I hope that shortly I will have more news to report of the effectiveness- I can say that my right eye feels great (it really does)- the left is still burning but I cautiously say that the burning seems lessened (and I say this VERY CAUTIOUSLY because I dont want to get myself or anyone excited too soon). I am willing to go the full way with this method and 4-6 treatments is recommended- I will do all 6 if necessary. Maintenence will be easier for me than others just because of where I live, but, again, if it works I know that we can find ways to keep it up- sometimes maintenence is only once a year.
And, I must say- the asthetics - my under eye skin looks so much better.
Has anyone else emailed Dr. Toyos? I have not heard back from my last two emails and I'd hate to bother him more- he must be very busy. If someone emails him it would be nice to ask if we could be in touch with some of his clients who have had this treatment- I'd love to hear firsthand experiences

Phillip- I will ask him about whether this will be offered in other locations anytime soon....still, I'd prefer to be treated by the doctor who invented the method and has been doing it for 7 years.

[irish eyes]

Sazy

Talking of meeting up with people with dry eye...

A work colleague recently said me that she suffered with dry eye like I do. I assumed she meant proper `DRY EYE' so I chattered on about the general frustration of it all. She said she was surprised that I had "....bothered the doctor with such a minor thing...".

It emerged that her idea of `dry eye' was that the NHS had misgivings about whether a person should wear contact lenses or not. It's nearly as bad as being advised `...to put water in your eyes.......and wouldn't it work the same?

That is why I so rarely want to bring up the topic with people who are not in the know.

[sazy123]

Hi Sazy- Yes, thanks again. Dr. Toyos' idea is something new and it does make sense. As for me, I had no idea that the blockage or vascularization was as bad as it is. Also, I didnt know the tengelesia (sp?) contributes to inflammation and further blockage but apparantly it does. Anyhow, I hope that tackling it will be what it takes to get rid of this darn problem for us! I still cant figure out why for now he wants me to abandon compresses though....all I can think is that maybe he thinks they are useless until the glands are open? I believe that he may be the answer for you, especially based on what you described you have in your last post. Also, it is promising that he is working on a method to eventually treat the upper lids- that is where I have the most tengelesia and there are supposedly more glands there as well.
I sent Dr. Toyos a few questions in an email. If I hear back from him I will post.
Sazy are you coming out here to try this? I wish I had an extra bedroom to offer but it is just me and my boyfriend and 3 dogs in a 1 bedroom condo
I would however love to meet up with you and even go with you to your first appointment.

Thats very kind of you to offer autumn how far from the clinic do you live? do you know of any cheap accommodation near by?
It would be nice to meet, neevr met anyone with bad dry eye!

[sazy123]

Sometimes I just cannot believe how on earth is it possible that this treatment - which has been around since 2002 -is only available by one doctor in one western country...

In consideration of the vast number of people suffering from malfunctioning MGs ophthalmologists from all over the well-off western societies should be happy to adopt this procedure.We have eye docs with modern practices and dozens of dry eye patients at every steet corner in Germany and a corresponding number of dermatologists who use IPL-machines (just not in the eye area..) routinely.

So, now you have to change your life plans entirely and do an internship/ au-pair or whatever in the US in order to get help??? C`mon people this canīt be true. We are living in the 21st century here....

We should try to make this procedure public in our areas as insistingly as possible. Spread the word people!

@autumnn: maybe you could bring this matter up again at your next appointment with him. He must have fellow colleagues who are interested in this and have already recieved some training from him. A huge number of people could benefit!!!

I think its a case that the procedure has been under investigation since that time, dr toyos would of had to apply for funding which he did as stated by the article, then undertake trials. As i dont think ophthalmologists would take this up without the evidence to back it up.

He did say in an email to me that he was in the process of rolling out training for the procedure to ophthalmologists.

[calli66]

Thanks Calli- I wonder if this applies to wild salmon?

I think it does...farmed salmon has it's problems, too, but I forget what.

Salmon's not the worst, of course (list of worse ones on the website link in my previous post). Some of the mercury content depends on where the wild salmon is caught---if the waters are contaminated. This can happen far from the source (say a coal power plant), due to prevailing winds and ocean currents.

Still...the word out there in the health community is that if you're a woman of child-bearing age, you shouldn't over-do certain seafood because of the mercury.

C